Daly 25. THATS why many Irish treated blacks in America and its also why many blacks treated Irish badly. could not agree more british took irish men in the 70s and 80s in belfast beat and tortured them the british government was later charged with crimes of humanity by the european courts. Im not looking to be inflammatory. Why do we continue to ignore the pain of others? The mass exodus from Ireland has been a result of famine, war, and conflict throughout Irelands history. Just to add the most interesting reference was to Dubhdaleithe adopted in Ireland as a first name according to that link. Like many ancient lands, Ireland has seen the arrival of settlers, explorers, ancient tribes, and clans of all different nationalities over centuries. Yeah, well done Harrison, first bit I read about James IIs proclamation 8 years before he was even born cracked me up! Or the violence committed by Irish American youth against POC in places like Boston and New York. In fact, many Norman invasion families grew to amend their family names (surnames) to reflect this. Blacks are/were not the only slaves. Is a Black slave with an Irish father any less Irish than African? I guess thats why they call it history. I think it was disingenuous to tell their story by minimizing the horrors experienced by African slaves. * Originally published 2013. The Irish and Scots-Irish did indeed own slaves in America and many of their emancipated slaves took their surname. Great article. Read up on the potato famine. smh. I can trace my Ancestry on my Maternal Grandmothers (Fathers) side of the Family Tree back to Ireland. "X" became the chosen surname of many black nationalists who rejected their slave names. Famous Clarkes include actresses Emilia Clarke and Melinda Mindy Clarke. Wants take a guess on my choice of colors ; Brown, White, Blue, and Black . For those of you keen to dig a little deeper into your roots, we suggest you check out ancestry.com! As far as calling them slaves for working while serving their sentence (BS). The Irish may have been treated like shit way back when, but nobody sold even one of them. Or did the Irish enjoy being slaves and never ran away from their slave masters? As with the Vikings, these were viewed as a people of "dark intentions" who ultimately colonized much of the Eastern part of the country and several larger towns. Dunne 28. Today black people are assimilated into western culture, et slavery hasnt ended. Politicians and ad writers do it daily. 2) Even if it were 100,000 of them (which it wasnt) , it is already documented that many of them were indentured servants-not slaves and theres a huge difference! as we see them as brothers no matter what skin tone you have. Very few are disputing that the British were horrific to the Irish, and to some extent, the Scottish as well. I am a Jamaican and I do know, based on teaching, that whites were experimented as slaves for a short period; however they failed to be productive in the climate and harsh conditions. Irish were indentured servants,which lasted 7 years. Black Irish Books, publishing house of American author Steven Pressfield. They became very wealthy and powerful at the expense of their foes and rivals. and to the edjit who called the ira terrorists. My theory contrary to the hypotheses here is America has made any skin color not light or white a lower lifeforms hence Irish are white Im I wrong. This slave trade, and the bigotry in the past and now, is very complicated issues; dont oversimplify them by making it an issue of Black vs White. Reblogged this on familytreegirldotcom and commented: And I would love to see references that prove that White Irish people were less expensive to purchase than African slaves. Byrne 8. Yes they did. What may be a mytth, however, is the numbers posited in the original article. Irish last names you may recognise from around the world are Murphy ( Murchadha in Gaelic) and Walsh (Breathnach in Gaelic). Though bigotry definitely had its part to play, the root of the issue, was nevertheless mostly about making a profit at the expense and exploitation of these slaves. Interesting read. So it comes as no surprise that no matter where you go, you tend to run into classic Irish names. There is little evidence to support this theory and it is unlikely that any significant number of Spanish soldiers would have survived long in the war-torn place that was 16th century Ireland. It is commonly found in County Tipperary and neighbouring counties. Slavers were greed driven sadists. With this, Irish people and families began to associate with the collective surname of ODubhghaill. Further, the statement, I am offended not by the story and the facts, but by the dishonest comparison. this is an insult to intellect! So incredibly well said and so true. The Origins of the Term 'Black Irish'. Im just now learning the depth of how horrible Irish slavery was. A total of 455,000 Africans out of 12.5 million were brought to America from the 17th century till it stopped in 1820. Many people tend come to the belief that African Blacks were the only ones in the entire world to fall victim to Slavery. One last thing, the only person / historian if you can really call him that ,since he is really just a flippin Englishman from Ireland .really he is descended from English lords which is why he is on ten different websites promoting irish slavery is a myth. Paris Donnatella is an avid writer and traveller. My grandmother was an indentured servant who came over here from Ireland to work with an English family later on my grandfather saw her or met her and decided to purchase her freedom from that English family so she so she was actually a slave / indentured servant herself, I was under the impressionthat the Irish came to America as indenture slaves. Well never know for sure. Norman-Catholic gentry? Thank you. Even to this day many still believe that Irish slavery only affected a few thousands. O'Doherty 16. In the sixteen hundreds EVERYONE came as indentured servants including Africans. In fact, ODubhghaill is the Gaelic version of the very popular Irish surname ODoyle. I get so tired of hearing about these damn Edomites (ie the Irish) and how they have suffered. Africans (Hamites) did not sell their own ppl. He had several indentured servants. And he made a profit out of it. Ryan 9. I have never heard of these Irish. While their decision did not stop pirates from doing what they desired, the new law slowly concluded THIS chapter of nightmarish Irish misery. I also have enslaved Africans in my lineage who have an Irish surname. Gee, did the Irish ever make whisky? Some of the most common Irish last names are Murphy ( Murchadha in Gaelic), Kelly ( Ceallaigh in Gaelic), OSullivan ( Silleabhin in Gaelic), and Walsh (Breathnach in Gaelic). In this decade, 52,000 Irish (mostly women and children) were sold to Barbados and Virginia. She has travelled Europe, Africa, America, Asia and Australia and still claims that wanderlust tempts her daily. I assume many of the ones the worked side by side with the Irish slaves used their last name in hopes of not being made to take the slave owners name. My Uncle Lon, born in the U.S. was shot in the head by the KKK in Sudbury Massachusetts back in the twenties. Notable Hughes include American business magnate Howard Hughes, and poet and activist Langston Hughes. The article highlights the horrors that happened, The extent of which is nightmarish. At that time, 70% of the total population of Montserrat were Irish slaves. Thank you for sharing the madness and anger that lives within my Irish family. That is why African Americans carry Irish surnames today. Ireland Before You Die is supported by its audience. Idiotic! Why because only blacks get to claim such horrible treatment of their people? Is what happend to the Irish also a fulfillment of prophecy? It generally refers to racial, ethnic or cultural roots. Evidence of last names in Ireland appears from around the early 900s, making it one of the first places in Europe to adopt hereditary surnames. When such a small society is reduced in such a short time by nearly half (during the famine) theres a whole host of socio-phycological problems that ensue, one youll be familiar with we often make light of now a days when it comes to The Irish is: alcoholism, but also extreme poverty, broken families, etc, which Im sure you can relate with as a member of the African American community in the United States am I right? By calling yourself black you are giving your power away. Argentina, Mexico, and New Zealand also share in high numbers of Irish descendants. I have to go back and check to see if the word slave is even in it. 1) A good number of slave masters were Scotch-Irish. They were dispised, were not allowed practice thier own religion, keep their own gaelic name, Own any kind of property, and denied the use of thier own language. Blacks could not blend in to normal society because most Blacks where slaves and most were not educated and they were not accepted in major segments of the country as entirely human. Nile of the nine hostages was a bit of a devil. Where does the Black and Irish identity stand in America? When enslaving whites/Christians became illegal in the U.S., the newly released white indentured servants became crackers/overseers and many became slave owners themselves. The main difference is that 600,000 people died in a civil war to end Black slavery, not Irish indentured service. An indentured servant is not a slave. Such things only serve to bring further division among human beings. In 1656, Cromwell ordered that 2000 Irish children be taken to Jamaica and sold as slaves to English settlers. They include Ardagh, Athy, Bray, Kelly, Sutton, and a few others. Hardly slavery, its a choice. Especially admitting anyone enslaved them!!!!!! Anglo-Irish) were in Ireland. They said the Irish were treated better. Lets not forget the Red vs White; Yellow vs White; and Brown vs White. Required fields are marked *. Great to hear the truth that MOST BRITISH dont want to hear COLM MAHER. Famous Doyles include writer and creator of Sherlock Holmes Arthur Conan Doyle, and novelist and screenwriter Roddy Doyle. Those who live in the north of the country may hold various national identities, including Irish, Northern Irish, and British. Rarely youll find them listed by age, gender and a first name NEVER A LAST NAME. This forced labour was in essence an extension of the English Poor Laws, e.g. Also, there is one difference between White Indentured servants or slaves and Black slaves in a country where Blacks are legally considered property. I dont know why white people are in such a hurry to prove theyre oppressed but this just isnt true. The argument is as follows: the Irish had an advantage because of their skin color. In this way of debate it subdivides the issue of slavery in degrees of worse and worse-er. This was a passage from the book noted above. They were INDENTURED SERVANTS as were the very first Africans brought to the colonies that became the USA which meant 1) they entered a voluntary agreement to exchange their time for passage to the USA or for some type of apprenticeship or training, 2) after a period of time their SERVICE ended usually about 7 years. The Irish rioted against the draft board in the 19th century, because war is horrible, and they were being forced into something that had nothing to do with. American soccer player Brian Mullan is one of the most famous people with the surname Mullan. Indeed, they legitimately had reasons for their grievances too. My only counter comment would be that slavery still exists in 21st century US through its prison industrial complex .. Black Irish (film), 2007 independent film by Brad Gann. If they were able to keep their names and their identities, there is no way that Irish people were treated as poorly as African people. The Mac prefix translates to the son of and is commonly seen in Irish surnames, as well as Scottish. 8. The whole thing is rotten no matter who. The most prominent O'Conors were the Connacht clan of O'Conor . Yet, as a subject of historical discussion, it is almost never referred to in Ireland. Interesting write up Eddie McFields. It was prophesied that our people would go into slavery on ships because we broke Gods commandments. First, there was intermarriage in early America before slavery. The notion that plantation owners fathered most mixed children is also false. This article attempts to make little of the term, indentured servitude, but the term has legal and Biblical definitions that give it limitations. Ive called for sources supporting the article although I am not entirely in disagreement with it, Ive provided a source on Irish indentured *slaves in this discussion that doesnt fit with your narrative of voluntary service. Regardless of the disputable facts of this particular article; Whites have been/are subjected to same level of cruel slavery as well. You are full of hate just as the Brits have planned, well done you have fallen for the divide and just by giving us the label of white you are empowering us. Google how and why enslaving whites/Christians was outlawed in the U.S. Im not going to do the research for you. There are a number of Irish Surnames like Duffy that specifically refer to Black. Burke One of the most famous McLoughlins is author and television presenter Coleen Rooney (neMcLoughlin). 10. When Britainnia was taken over by the English (Germans) they immediately attacked the Irish and Scots and deported these black people to the West Indies, the women that remained were raped and whitenised by the red haired German invaders. It derives from the Gaelic word Ciarn, ciar meaning black, and -an being a diminutive suffix. Clearly this makes it a Black vs White issue. It seems by your statements that Whites are the only skin color capable of being bigots, slave traders/owners, and oppressors. This is what I could find so far: No statistical reference to Ireland at least on Ancestry: I am mixed with other things but my maiden name is McClure. Smith 6. There is a prevailing debate amongst the commentators that leaves me with strong feelings of indignation. Lets not forget the largely convenient (for the British) Great Famine (one of many actually, and not the greatest either) with saw 1 to 2 million starve to death, and several more million emigration since the Plantation, settlement and colonization of Ireland. The turnover would not be that high if whites treated enslaved blacks with even a modicum of kindness. It did not begin that way even for Blacks/Africans. http://www.irishsurnames.com/cgi-bin/gallery.pl?name=dudley&capname=Dudley&letter=d. Over centuries, as groups arrived and fled, ancient Ireland began to take shape. it didnt matter whether you were Irish, English,Welsh, Scottish, Black, White, or any other race or colour, you just needed to be POOR. So for me. Enough is enough. After Cromwell there was such a situation, that later was deemed less desirable in a cost/benefit calculation, because of Irish poverty they could get the same benefit by using indentured servitude.*footnote. And why so many Georgians have stories about helping that White boy run to the mountains. From 1641 to 1652, over 500,000 Irish were killed by the English and another 300,000 were sold as slaves. However Middle English blac also meant 'pale wan' a reflex of Old English blc 'pale white' with a shortened vowel. Famous Sheehans include bass guitarist Billy Sheehan and American writer Susan Sheehan. 7. This proclamation lasted 200 years ,ending some 9-13 years before Black Slavery Emancipation. The Irish were brought over as indentured servants. why do so many people dismiss the truth about irish slave black and white people dismiss the truth. Presbyterian freeholders? It remains, therefore, a descriptive term used for many purposes, rather than a reference to an actual class of people who may have survived the centuries. Sure, some of their names have changed, but there are still plenty of McCoys, Buchanans and other very Irish last names out there in them thar hills. We shouldnt be in the business of a numbers game when it comes measuring ils with a much smaller indigenous culture (the native Gaelic Catholics) of Ireland with as compared to the West and Sub-Saharan African regions. And so on.., http://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/the-stolen-village-des-ekin/1113681635?ean=9781847174314#productInfoTabs. Please do not confuse the two. look im from ireland we are not racist people. I know for some sorry isnt enough and I agree .However Im more concerned with my family that was shackled, bound, branded raped, sold. Otherwise, I agree there needs to be some factual citations presented with the article. You all talking rubbish, Under 800 years of English rule millions of irish died at the hand of the British. As things evolved though the change from indentured to enslaved came in a big way because of the darker skin tone making it easier to identify runaways and the popularity of black Africans entering a lifetime period of slavery is why indentured servitude was replaced with full on actual slavery. there is another book to read; which indicates that the so-called American Revolution was spurred on by slave revolts in the west indies. By the mid 1600s, the Irish were the main slaves sold to Antigua and Montserrat. Records state that, after the 1798 Irish Rebellion, thousands of Irish slaves were sold to both America and Australia. This is how many other current events were going at the time, that is, not in the favor of the south. So not forgotten but definitely no true or meaningful comparison. Until then, Africans were primarily indentured servants, just like the Irish and other white immigrants to the New World. Only a few took on the last names of their former owners, some took names from the Bible. Meaning: Son of the blacksmith. Jim Crow laws where formulated to keep Blacks in their place, not the Irish. My Great great great grandmother was the daughter of an Irish Slave Owner. From a real Irish person, who didnt get shipped over to America but whos ancestors have fought against the oppression of Britannia and ultimately Rome (the Pope) for over 800years. There is little question that the Irish experienced the horrors of slavery as much (if not more in the 17th Century) as the Africans did. All the people who were desperately trying to find something or someone to debunk irish slavery never looked at his credentials lol ..Liam hogan again isnt a irish historian, he is a self taught librarian,yet he is on 20 some odd websites and 30 some odd blogs lol hahahaha like are u guys serious????? Carran A spelling variant of Curran, this Irish surname is an anglicized form of ' Corraidhin' referring to 'descendant of Corraidhin.' The word Corraidhin is derived from 'Corradh' which means 'little spear.' If you dont think so then sign over your person to an employer for a while and tell me if that feels like service. Actress Katherine MacNamara is the most famous person with the surname MacNamara. It depend ends on how you look at it!!!!!!! Sullivan is the 92nd most popular surname in the United States and the third most common surname in Ireland . William Downing and Philip Welch. Follow the links below to find out more about Irish last names. Sons James Catholic bishop of Pirtland Maine Patrick Jesuit priest who made Georgetown University. Forgetting the past opens the door to repeating its horrors . Whether the stereotype is based on truth or not, I have no personal knowledge. The same empire, including the Spanish and French, therefore, initiated the slave trade in North America. There are good apples and bad apples in every group of people, and people tend to do things based on more local things than racial ideology. Barbados has an enclave on the island, the descendants of Irish slaves who never integrated with others, they speak with a slight Irish accent but as a race they suffer from alcoholism and diabetes and inbreeding. Irish version of McFadden = MacPidn, Irish version of McDonald = MacDhmhnaill. They could be biological descendants of an Irish or Scottish family. Some of us blow it off, move on, and create a better life for our families. Notable Cunninghams include American professional basketball player Dante Cunningham and football quarterback Randall Cunningham. Many of our foremothers were raped by the ships captains and the dozens if not hundreds of white crew members. and then share it for the world to see. There are particular surnames associated with the pre-removal period. They owned the land in Ireland too where Catholic Irish worked on their lands. Did they have a say in being sold off to a new master? This very old and famous surname, equally popular in Scotland and England, has at least two possible origins, the first being a nickname given by the invading Angles and Saxons to the native Celts and Britons who were darker-haired and darker-skinned than themselves.